Sunday, August 14, 2005

How Did They Know?

On September 11th, none of the New York City rescue people thought any of the World Trade Centers would collapse. For example:

The battalion chief of the New York Fire Department stated "there was never a thought that this whole thing is coming down" (page 15)

The Emergency Medical Services Division Chief, in charge of planning for the Chief of Department’s office said "No one feared that the building was in any danger as a result of two airplane attacks and subsequent fires . . . ."(page 7)

A lieutenant firefighter said "I never thought the whole thing would come down"

A firefighter stated "I never expected that a tower might collapse"

A lieutenant Investigator with the Bureau of Investigations and Trials said "no one ever expected it to collapse like that" (page 18)

The firefighters killed in the towers clearly never expected that they would collapse

And no engineer in the country, including the designers of the world trade centers, thought they would collapse. Indeed, "experts said no building like it, a modern, steel-reinforced high-rise, had ever collapsed because of an uncontrolled fire" (summary is free if you register with the New York Times; full article is pay-per-view), and the twin towers were designed to survive airplane strikes.

Indeed, the 9/11 Commission Report itself states:

"They also received advice from senior FDNY chiefs that while the building might eventually suffer a partial collapse on upper floors, such structural failure was not imminent. NO ONE ANTICIPATED THE POSSIBILITY OF A TOTAL COLLAPSE" (Page 291)

"Prior to 9:59, no NYPD helicopter pilot predicted that either tower would collapse" (page 304)

"Though almost no one at 9:50 on September 11 was contemplating an imminent total collapse of the Twin Towers, many first responders and civilians were contemplating the possibility of imminent additional terrorist attacks . . . " (page 320); and

"Contrary to a widely held misperception, no NYPD helicopter predicted the fall of either tower before the South Tower collapsed" (page 321)

And yet, somehow, on 9/11, Mayor Rudy Giuliani knew in advance that the world trade center was going to collapse (see also this article).

And newly-released tapes of firefighters and other emergency personnel show that New York's Office of Emergency Management told a handful of people that the twin towers were going to collapse BEFORE any building had actually collapsed. For example, a paramedic testified that, before ANY of the world trade center buildings had collapsed, the following occurred:

John came to me and said you need to go find Chief Ganci and relay the following message: that the buildings have been compromised, we need to evacuate, they're going to collapse . . . .

I mentioned to the EMS people there, again, not knowing who they were, I said you need to get away from here, the building might collapse, we need to leave this spot . . .

I said, Steve, where's the boss? I have to give him a message. He said, well, what's the message? I said the buildings are going to collapse; we need to evac everybody out. With a very confused look he said who told you that? I said I was just with John at OEM. OEM says the buildings are going to collapse; we need to get
out . . . .

He said, hey, Pete, we got a message that the buildings are going to collapse. His reply was who the fuck told you that? Then Steve brought me in and with Chief Ganci, Commissioner Feehan, Steve, I believe Chief Turi was initially there, I said, listen, I was just at OEM. The message I was given was that the buildings are going to collapse; we need to get our people out. At that moment, this thunderous, rolling roar came down and that's when the building came down, the first tower came down”
(page 6)

And there was also warning that building 7, which was not even hit by a plane, was going to collapse. Indeed, people “waited around” for the building to collapse.

For example, right before WTC7 came down, a NYPD police officer said clear away, the whole building is "about to blow up"

A firefighter stated "They moved us back south. We ended up back up on Vesey Street and West Street and just hanging out until tower 7 came down. After tower 7 came down, we went right to work over at tower 7 to put the fires out" (page 9)

Another firefighter testified "Once they got us back together and organized somewhat, they sent us back down to Vesey, where we stood and waited for Seven World Trade Center to come down" (page 14)

A firefighter said "I don't know what happened to No. 7. I knew the building was coming down" (page 8)

A lieutenant firefighter said Basically, we fell back for 7 to collapse, and then we waited a while and it got a lot more organized, I would guess" (page 17)

A paramedic testified “Then it was about 5:00 . . . We didn't do any further because building number seven was coming down. That was another problem, to wait for building seven to come down, because that was unsecure. It was about 5:30 that building came down” (Pages 13-14)

Indeed, many news reporters, including reporters from the BBC (and see this BBC clip; BBC clips authenticated here, here, and here), CNN and other stations reported the collapse of Building 7 before it actually fell, thus strongly implying that someone informed the reporters of the collapse ahead of time.

See also this collection of evidence regarding building 7.

And if you have any doubt about the foreknowledge concerning the collapse of Building 7, watch this 13-minute video.

What if a police detective was investigating the murder of a guy named Joe, who had previously been healthy, and discovered that a suspect had said on the day of the murder "Joe will be dead within 2 hours"? The detective would believe that the suspect killed Joe, or at least conspired with those who did.

Similarly, the foreknowledge of the collapse of buildings 1, 2 and 7 – when steel-framed buildings simply do not collapse due to fire – is strong circumstantial evidence that Guiliani and some key people within New York's Office of Emergency Management -- or their superiors in the chain of command -- are guilty for the demolition of those buildings.

We've all watched enough detective shows on TV to recognize this foreknowledge as evidence of guilt.




50 Comments:

Blogger Trooth Decay said...

Preach on brother! Congrats on getting noted by WRH.com.
There's more and more articles every day claiming that Al Qaeda commited the atrocities behind 9/11 while evry day there's mountains of evidence of government orchestration being ignored by the media. Well done in honing out a well quoted article.

9:22 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The more EYES and EARS and MINDS working on deciphering the mass of evidence will help to REVEAL the truth. We have all heard the LIES and DECEPTION that the media and their "masters" have used as pure propaganda.

This is important that we work together as individual detectives, such as

whatreallyhappened.com

to find the truth. The inconsistencies, contradictions, lies, and false "facts" that the US/Israel is pumping out is OBVIOUS and apparent to those who know the facts and think for themselves.

Now that the rest of the radio transcripts and recordings are forced to be made available to the general PUBLIC is a once in a lifetime opportunity.

It is up to us, the patriotic citizen, the uncover the lies and deception that threw us into WAR with Iraq, Afghanistan, and soon to be either Iran/Korea/Syra/anywhere with oil.

11:21 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yes indeed valid points, but watching detective stories are a part of the American peoples problem, besides when the evidence is standing there before you in the form of what had, did, and followed that day one would have to have some severe mental defeciancies to have not figured it out by the time the second plane hit. No detective work needed here, those events do not happen in reality, they are impossible and absurd to the point of being unworthy of a B hollywood movie.
The biggest challenge is to get the masses of the pathetic broken American people to find courage and morality to face , not the powers that be, oh no, they need to look themselves in the mirror and face the reality of who they are, what they've become, and where they would like to go from here. Ultimately 911 happened because the American people allowed it to happen . They knew America has become so moraly and mentaly corrupt they could get away with anything at all, the American people simply don't care,are too ignorant, naive,cowardly and misguided (can't forget too fat to move)to do anything against these weak and rather stupid cowardly nasty people running the show.
Shameful, worthless, broken, stupid people this is your fault. Find your balls stop obeying the dictates of these traitor fascists and figure out what patriotism actualy is. Otherwise who cares what happens to you, you can go right to hell and you would deserve it.

12:10 AM  
Blogger ELMAHDI said...

It is important that the media once again returns to its role as a vangaurd against the encroachments of excesive government. The Media is supposed to question the official line.

It seems very simple. Just examine who stands to gain the most from any given situation. The party with motive is generally the guilty one. Bush, Gullianni, Israel and Big Oil were looking pretty weak in 2001. Each had agenda's. Each of these parties have significantly proffited from 911.

Bush is a criminal. He intentionally sent Americans to invade another soveriegn nation for reasons that turned out to be without any justifiable legal merit. According to International Law, he is a criminal. Saddam may have been belly lint, but we had no legal right to remove him. In fact, we had no morale right to interfere in the affairs of another nation. Especially since we were the ones who armed him to fight a war for us against Iran. You know, the country that Bush wants to invade within the next few weeks.

It is so sad that the Law has lost all of its meaning. What set America apart from the rest of the world for much of the past 50 years was that we were a nation of laws. We used to be looked upon as a generous if overly self obssessed nation. We were known as fat and silly, yet liked. That was then. Now we are known as a nation in decline allowing a mad man to drag us into one misadventure after another, all in some crazy scheme to bring on the end of times.

I hope that all of you talk to at least two people that you know and sign a petition calling for Bush's Impeachment. It is the first step in a process that will get us our country back. Once Bush is impeached, we can apologize to the world and get back to business as usual

12:39 AM  
Blogger ELMAHDI said...

End all Welfare to the terrorist sponsering apartheid theocracy of Israel. Israel is a threat to US National Security. Remember the USS Liberty. Americans should not be dying in iraq for Israel. While all Israeli's get free health care for life, courtesy of American tax dollars, seniors in our own country cant even afford their medication. Whatever happened to taking care of Americans first? You tell the truth and get branded a leftie or anti semite. The truth is the truth. Do your own research. You do not have to take my word for it... Israel and traitors within our own govt. were responsible for 911. Think of all the major players in 2001 and think how they proffited.. Bush went from being hated by most of the country for stealing the election to an approval rating of 90%, talk about wag the dog!!! Gullianni went from a man who just got whupped by Hillary Clinton, was being associated with Hitler for his gestapo style policing tactics to a serious contender for the next presidential race. Israel is getting even more money now. Even Bolton got his UN job. Ask questions. Look at the facts do your own research. Buildings built specificaly to withstand impacts from planes do not collapse on the day that FEMA coincidentally scheduled an emergency drill. Just like the odds of the exact same thing happening in London (emergency crews were running field maneuvers) does bear some examining. A little too much coincidence. Do your own research. We all know Bush lied about the WMDS... what else has he lied about?

12:49 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

As long as American's donot loose faith in themselves and what's left of the constitution you just might make it out of this political hole. Most of the word's coming from politicians is the rhetoric of failure but those closest to the 911 hell are stuck in behind the walls of a prison cell once they know the truth or if you have any conscience left. They kill president's and traffic people and drug's and run corrupted governments and if you still would like play your part in that system that they have full control over where you answer to no one, than you will see where your rewards will lie. I can't wait to see a lebian become the president of the united states, that'll really put the Muslim community on edge being told how to run their country by a Lez with a husband [former president] probably still fooling around with other married women giving her advice like Bush senior does for the little horse milker.

2:57 AM  
Anonymous Another Anonymous said...

ELMAHDI - you wrote "What set America apart from the rest of the world for much of the past 50 years was that we were a nation of laws." That is simply not so - there are a great many other countries who have long enjoyed the rule of law, including all the European countries. In fact, in all these other countries, people have long regarded the American judicial system as being totally corrupt.

5:00 AM  
Anonymous dz said...

i like your allusion to the prior knowledge to a homicide, it really puts it in an appropriate context.

6:57 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Al Qaeda--"the database"--is simply another, and grandly successful, CIA Gladio, on a global scale. Since when was the USA opposed by an extreme right-wing group, anyway? Look who comes out of it all semlling like roses--the CIA and its "intelligence-gathering" capabilities, as Operations wins another one over Intelligence, and Negroponte gets a free hand over the entire fricking IC. The result of 9-11 and all the rest of this crap, including the Neo-con disinfo (that is, the single-minded emphasis on the evil neocons, to take the public's eyes off the secret-government-as-usual) is another metamorphosis of the secret government, not seen on such a scale since the establishment of the NSC and the CIA in 1947. Simply put, the deep strategy (always to serve the shallowest of ends--keeping the world open for American business)was to create a series of events that would necessitate the evolution of the secret government into something capable of dealing with the "multi-threat" world--post-Cold War--basically, in terms of the CIA (corporate boards), a world where multiple trade blocs can arise in an era of unprecedented fuel scarcity and global warming, and the American economy can collapse like a house of cards.

Most Americans, minds already completely circumscribed by the conditions of reality imposed by our secret government (last window opened: 1970s), would probably thank the CIA for all their hard work, keeping the AWOL and the American Dream alive. Thank them even for Abu Ghraib, which made torture into a dirty little secret you don't talk about in polite company, that nags at us, but that we know we have to do to make the evil ones look like perverts in front of their fellow mujahedeen. The game is constructing the rest of the world as caricatures, keeping us inside our bubble.

7:23 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I believe that al-Qaeda is real. Every time the Zionist media pushes this story remember that al-Qaeda is an asset of the CIA-Mossad-MI6.
When one starts looking beyond the propaganda the money always leads back to this Zionist group.

10:31 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Tremendous reporting, investigation, balance...fair judgment.

Who needs the MSM with you, Mike Rivero of WRH, and for something a touch more mainstream, but also quite good, Amy Goodman at Democracy NOW!

Balance. Truth.

This is a smoking gun; yet another of the hidden weapons of mass destruction belonging to bush and company revealed!

Now, weapons or no weapons? That is the question. When is evil so great, so entrenched, that it must be forceably removed?

If our Congress and Senators fail to react, when our dissent is silenced in the MSM, what options remain at our disposal?

Revolution is coming, but will this cabal be tossed out with a whimper, or a bang?

11:25 AM  
Anonymous Amanda Reconwith said...

Please note that the first four links are to graphics that depict a card game that was developed in 1990 and marketed in 1995.

This is the card that they have been playing:
http://www.cuttingedge.org/rewriting_history.jpg

These two cards have been played:
http://www.cuttingedge.org/Terrorist_nuke.jpg
http://www.cuttingedge.org/pentagon.jpg

This is the next card:
http://www.cuttingedge.org/epidemic.jpg\

The Bush/Cheney 9/11 Conspiricy Theory is a complete fabrication. Anytime anyone mentions hijackers they are perpatrating a cover story and hoax. They ONLY reason the four aircraft's transponders were turned off was to fool and confuse the RADAR READERS to substitute other aircraft. NONE and I repeat NONE of the 9/11 targets were struck by any passenger jet aircraft. In fact, most of the so called passengers did not exist. Once you have compiled all vital records of all claimed passengers you will discover that the majority of them do not exist at all.



The Discovery Channel documentary, 'The Flight That Fought Back', produced by London-based Brook Lapping Productions,is based on research evidence including the 9/11 Commission Report and voice recordings left by passengers and crew members of United flight 93, including the famous "Let's roll" call to action, from passenger Todd Beamer.
There is only one problem: Todd Beamer does not exist.

Do a Social Security Death Index search for Todd
Beamer at :

http://ssdi.genealogy.rootsweb.com/

You get one record with the date of birth as SEPTEMBER
ELEVENTH, 1968 and date of death as 6/10/97.

Of the passengers and crew of Flight 11, 77, 175 & 93,
only 22%, 22%, 28%, 13% respectively are in the Social
Security Death Index.

Todd Beamer's marriage:
I prepared for our wedding on May 14,1994. I had
always wanted to move back East,
... Our wedding took place at the First Baptist Church
in Peekskill, New York
pg 97 "Let's Roll" by Lisa Beamer

Do a marriage license search at:

http://www.genlookups.com/ny_marriages/

There are no marriage license records for Todd Beamer
and Lisa Brosious!

Look at the date this website was setup- 9/12/01!!! and he is not in the SSDI nor has any "family" member applied to the September 11th Compensation Fund of 2001

Domain ID:D77223487-LROR

Domain Name:MARKBINGHAM.ORG

Created On:12-Sep-2001 17:06:44 UTC

http://markbingham.org/

http://www.whois.net/

http://911digitalarchive.org/objects/3.pdf

http://ssdi.genealogy.rootsweb.com/


Of the 266 people that we were told died on these
jets, only 11 relatives applied for compensation!

Flight 11: of the 92 people who are listed as dying on
this flight, only 20 are listed in the SSDI (22%)

Of these 20 people, only three are on the 9-11
Compensation Fund list:

Judy Larocque
Laurie Neira
Candace Lee Williams

=======================================

Flight 77: of the 64 people who are listed as dying on
this flight, only 14 are listed in the SSDI (22%)

Of these 64 people, only five on the 9-11 Compensation
Fund list:

William Caswell
Eddie Dillard
Ian Gray
John Sammartino
Leonard Taylor

=======================================

Flight 175: of the 65 people who are listed as dying
on this flight, only 18 are listed in the SSDI (28%)

Of these 65 people, only three are on the 9-11
Compensation Fund list:

Michael C. Tarrou
Gloria Debarrera
Timothy Ward

=======================================

Flight 93: of the 45 people who are listed as dying on
this flight, only 6 are listed in the SSDI (13%)

Of these 45 people, none are on the 9-11 Compensation
Fund list:

No one

=======================================
Maybe this is why:

Plane Lands In Cleveland; Bomb Feared Aboard
Reported by: 9News Staff
Web produced by: Liz Foreman
9/11/01 11:43:57 AM

"A Boeing 767 out of Boston made an emergency landing
Tuesday at Cleveland Hopkins International Airport due
to concerns that it may have a bomb aboard, said Mayor
Michael R. White.

White said the plane had been moved to a secure area
of the airport, and was evacuated.

United identified the plane as Flight 93. The airline
[didn't] say how many people were aboard the flight.
United said it was also "deeply concerned" about
another flight, Flight 175, a Boeing 767, which was
bound from Boston to Los Angeles.

On behalf of the airline CEO James Goodwin said: "The
thoughts of everyone at United are with the passengers
and crew of these flights. Our prayers are also with
everyone on the ground who may have been involved.
"United is working with all the relevant authorities,
including the FBI, to obtain further information on
these flights," he said." -WCPO-TV (09/11/01)


http://web.archive.org/web/20021109040132/http:/wcpo.com/specials/2001/americaattacked/news_local/story14.html
http://inn.globalfreepress.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=323
http://www.usdoj.gov/archive/victimcompensation/
http://911digitalarchive.org/objects/3.pdf
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/AA11.victims.html
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/AA77.victims.html
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/ua93.victims.html
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/ua175.victims.html
http://www.arcticbeacon.com/articles/article/1518131/30199.htm

Regarding another shock and awe program:
Is the WizOrd® Intelligent Initiation System the 7/7 fuse?
http://www.ebco-aerospace.com/aerospace/wizord.php

9:09 AM  
Blogger KC said...

Amanda, I thought you may be onto something with the death list. As a genealogy buff, I am upset I didnt think about it. However, there seems to be a problem with SSDI Master list. My mother died in 1998 . SHE IS NOT LISTED anywhere, I was at ancestry.com , rootsweb, even LDS who keep all the records for the US ( the mormons), and she is not there. This I find really strange, as I have found my grandparents who died in early 1990's. I dont beilieve these lists to be any longer reliable, other then writing to SS Directly. But then you need to prove you are related. Since I started looking ( before this discovery) I found 2 people of the 11 listed as AA FLT 11 Employees.

On another note the card game, (Illumanti) I found of great interest. I remember Brzynski's the grand chess board, It appears we are all nothing but pawns in a ginat card game being played in smoky backrooms.

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Anonymous Awoken Research Group said...

Subconsciously, people know that buildings don't just fall down. That's why 9/11 was such a shock. It stretched our minds to deny previously conceived notions about the world and physics in general.
For some of us, it didn't work.

9:22 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Just came across your site while looking for something else. Thought you might find this interesting. Try looking up de-classified gov.'t document called The Northwoods Document.

1:38 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

My two cents: Inevitably, truth will be declared a lie... Which might lead US to ask, WHAT IS TRUTH? Are we perhaps deceived by anti-american interests to believe that 9/11 is a hoax? And [take this] Why not believe the lie?

Let us not get caught up in PROOF when WE are reasonably assured....


Let US make preparations for how to exist in the Fourth Reich with the realities of peak oil.

Tell the ones you love:

Things are dire.

It might be a waste of time to try to convince the sheeple...

I myself plan to head for the hills with automatic rifles.

11:39 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Captain Karin Deshore, Paramedic Battalion Commander, gave these comments in an interview by Mike Tambasko of the World Trade Center Task Force, on November 7, 2001

"....Somewhere around the middle of the World Trade Center, there was this orange and red flash coming out. Initially, it was just one flash. Then this flash just kept popping all the way around the building and that building had started to explode. The popping soun, and with each popping sound, it was initially an orange and then a red flash, came out of the building and then it would just go all arounfdthe building on both sides as far as I could see. These popping sounds and the explosions were getting bigger, both going up and down and then all around the building. I went inside and told everybody that the other or there was one explosion occuring up there and I said, I think we have another major explosion"........So here these explosions are getting bigger and louder and bigger and louder and I told everybody "if this building totally explodes", still unaware that the other building had collapsed"I'm going in the water"

Sounds like controlled demolition to me.

9:21 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Could it be possible that "the powers" knew that if the tower's were ever in jeopardy of naturally toppling over from an attack, this toppling would fall on alot of other buildings, killing many more people. Could they have authorized secretly, especially after the 1993 attack on the towers, a demolition squad to set charges throughout the twin towers to demolish them in the event a future event jeopardized the towers? The same could be said for the damage WTC 7 would have done if it toppled. Everyone seems to agree that for WTC 7 it was decided to "pull it" by the "powers" around 5 pm & they did. It was demolished just as surely as the twin towers. Instead of unscrupulous reasons, perhaps these were pre-emptive moves to curb loss of life. Even OEM tried to get the firefighters out of the building. Of course, the use of this tragic event to advantage by corrupt businessmen, politicians, President/staff is unconscientable.

1:38 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

all i can do is shake my head at your stupidity....

so sad.

1:19 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I don't understand the last remark, right before this one ...
What is that sposed to mean?

2:37 AM  
Blogger a Canadian said...

I'm Canadian and I stumbled upon this topic by accidnet hours ago.. I accidentally saw United 93 2006, the movie. (I'm not sure the exact title). I've been reading since, telling my mom about what I'm finding out. I'm in shock.. I am quite a forensics buff to boot, but even so it's absolutely irrefutable, with the amount of information sited on these websites and in the movie. I can't believe I haven't heard formal accusations before. I'm not at all surprised that the government could do it but still it seems surreal.. I pray for all of us, especially Americans - that they can get out of this horrendous Bush administration. I hope that the truth WILL be known.. soon enough for Bush and the perpetrators to be absolutely ruined by what they've done. THEN they can go to Hell.

12:25 AM  
Blogger Bosephus Jamiroquai said...

Hate to be a party crasher but somebody's got to say something. I'd like to start by saying that I don't intend to be disrespectful. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and theories. I just thought perhaps I could help balance the ideas here.

Just because you found a lot of quotes from a lot of people saying that they did not expect the building to collapse due to fire, that doesn't mean that it is impossible for the building to collapse due to the damage caused by the plane and subsequent fire.

You are right about one thing. “…steel-framed buildings simply do not collapse due to fire…” But steel framed buildings that that are struck by airliners traveling at 490 (N Tower) and 590 (S Tower) mph respectively and then burned with tens of thousands of gallons of jet fuel, well some might consider that to be over and beyond a traditional structure fire. No one is arguing that fire alone caused the collapse. It was TREMENDOUS structural damage as well as EXTREME heat and the SPECIFIC ARCHITECTURE of the building that lent to the collapse.

The WTC was designed with lighter, hollower construction than traditional skyscrapers, allowing fire to burn not only hotter but deeper into the structural support of the building (as opposed to a traditional “brick and mortar” skyscraper which would have been much more difficult to penetrate and a much greater percentage of the damage would have affected the outside of the building). This allowed the planes to penetrate deeper into the core of the building and weaken the structural integrity and fireproofing measures. Finally, steel loses a great deal of its strength at high temperatures. The fire weakened the steel and contributed to the collapse. Evidence of this is the fact the South Tower collapsed earlier than the North Tower even though it was struck more than 15 minutes later. This is because the South Tower was hit at a lower point in the tower with greater speed, and so sustained greater damage and had more weight to support above the site of impact.

To say that "no building like it... had ever collapsed due to uncontrolled fire" doesn't necessarily lend credence to your argument in this situation. (I’ll ignore the fact that this is a quote from the Chicago Tribune concerning building 7, NOT 1 and 2 for now). It is true that there have been fires in buildings like this before, and none of them have collapsed. But these buildings were hit by a PLANE and then thousands of gallons of jet fuel burned uncontrollably inside them. This is a structural engineering scenario that is certainly different from a simple building fire.

You quote the Lieutenant Investigator for the Bureau of Investigations and Trials, but that quote is horribly out of context. You imply by dropping his title that this gentleman was investigating the collapse and made this conclusion through his investigation.

Instead, he was a man who already happened to be conducting an investigation at the fire house for Engine 10 Truck 10 when the attacks occurred. The quote you supplied was what he said about the activity in and around the fire house immediately after the attacks occurred. He was speaking about their initial reaction to seeing the buildings burn and their subsequent rush to give aid. Of course they didn’t “expect it to collapse like that.” They had no information whatsoever at that point as to what had even happened, much less the structural damage that had occurred – and certainly not detailed schematics of the building infrastructure. My point is that his statement wasn’t given as, nor was it meant to be interpreted as, expert opinion. The same goes for firefighters; while they may know a lot more than you or I about structural integrity, they certainly aren’t structural engineers.

There have been multiple reports given by both governmental and independent investigatory groups concerning the cause of the buildings’ collapse. There is disagreement as to what caused the collapse – but only in the sense of WHY the fires caused the collapse, specifically. There is not disagreement as to WHETHER the fires caused the collapse.

Just because the firefighters and others you quoted didn't EXPECT it to collapse doesn't mean that it was inconceivable to everyone on the planet. That is a huge jump in logic. (Also, where do you get your information that "no engineer in the country" thought that they would collapse? Have you done a poll?) All of the quotes you provide are people talking about their feelings and expectations based on the information they had at the time, NOT what has been discovered since. None of your quotes from these sources assert that the building SHOULD NOT have collapsed, only that they didn’t expect it to.

Your theories aside, can you tell me whether you think THIS scenario is POSSIBLE:

1. Those on the immediate scene including most firefighters, the EMSD chief, the investigators, etc. - based on past history of building fires - did not expect the building to collapse. They treat it like any other building fire and work to get the people out.

2. Someone, perhaps a structural engineer or some other expert in the OEM realizes, based on some number crunching or whatever, that "Oh crap with this sort of damage, that much heat, this type of structure design, etc. it's possible that these buildings are coming down."

3. The OEM relays the message "Get people out of the area. The building could collapse."

4. It's too late, the message only gets to a select few, and tragically the buildings collapse and kill thousands.

The quotes you give indicate that no one EXPECTED to building to collapse AT THE TIME IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING THE CRASH. But no credible expert finds it to be a mystery that the building COLLASPED AT ALL. You are putting words in their mouths when you use those quotes, out of context, to support the idea that it is impossible for that building to collapse because of the damage done by the planes.

Just as a similar example - The Hindenburg.
"The Germans had much experience with hydrogen and no hydrogen fire accidents had occurred on civil Zeppelins, so this switch from helium did not cause alarm. Knowing the risks of hydrogen gas, the engineers used various safety measures, including treating the airship's coating to prevent electric sparks. Such was their confidence in their ability to handle hydrogen that a smoking room was present on the Hindenburg; it was pressurized to keep hydrogen out."

Despite all this, and the fact that no one feared that the Hindenburg was in danger, and no one on board "expected" it to EXPLODE, it surely did just that.

Would it be logical to round up quotes from the German engineers, passengers and crew of the Hindenburg in which they all attest that no one thought this would happen - and then use those quotes as evidence to the idea that the Hindenburg was sabotaged? Is that clean logic?

Finally, you take the idea that officials knew that the buildings were going to collapse minutes before they did as further proof that the buildings were collapsed intentionally by explosives. But if the government was willing to kill thousands of people for some hidden agenda, why warn anyone at all that the buildings would fall?

The story related by the paramedic sounds like a last minute warning given by safety officials who had just learned of the possibility of collapse and who then, of course, ordered their men out of there. I don’t see anything suspicious about it at all.

You quote firemen and other witnesses as saying that they were moved to safety or asked to fall back to avoid being hurt by the collapsing buildings. Yes, this indicates that they knew the buildings were going to collapse. Lots and lots and lots of buildings collapse because of fire. When officials can tell that a building is going to collapse, what do they do? They evacuate. They move people to safety.

Just might sound crazy, but what if civil engineers were called in to assess damage, and they could tell that building 7 was near collapse and so they moved people to safety? When building 7 collapsed, was there a flash or an explosion heard immediately prior to the collapse? Why would they intentionally collapse the third building nearly seven hours after the second tower collapsed, and again, why warn everyone and keep everyone at a safe distance if the whole point was to kill as many as possible?

What could they have done that you would not have used against them? If they had known but not moved people out, of course you would be outraged – and rightly so. But instead, they DID move people to safety, and you offer that as proof of their evil agenda. That doesn’t even make sense.

If anything, the fact that so many officials, including Mayor Giuliani, openly told the press that at one point they realized the buildings were going to fall and ordered an evacuation of all rescue personnel seems contrary to the idea of keeping a secret plan secret, and contrary to the idea of killing as many people as possible.

Your detective analogy does not hold water. First of all, the paramedic’s warning came AFTER WTC 1 and 2 had already sustained heavy damage, and only minutes before the first collapse (according to the paramedic). The warning of WTC 7 also came AFTER the building had sustained heavy damage from the collapse of the other two towers. So if these buildings are “Joe,” they certainly aren’t “healthy.” They are beat up and on the verge of death. If Joe had been shot, stabbed and poisoned and was lying on the ground coughing up blood, then someone said “Joe will be dead within 2 hours.” I don’t think they’d be held suspect.

Say Joe was going to die because someone had infected him with a highly contagious, highly deadly disease. Would the person who infected him be interested in keeping others from being harmed by their proximity to Joe? Then why would they move people out of the way of the falling buildings?

Here's a better analogy than yours: what if a doctor took a look at Joe and realized that he only had less than two weeks to live? Would that doctor be implicated in Joe's death if Joe were to pass away within the next few days? No.

You take huge, HUGE leaps to reach the conclusions you have come to. Have you ever heard of Ockham’s Razor? Look it up.

1:37 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

A physics professor, Steven Jones, of BYU has written a scholarly paper on his doubts about the official story regarding the collapse of the towers and WTC7. If you google steven jones you will be able to read his paper and also see a video of a 90 minute presentation he made on the subject at BYU recently. He addresses several key points including the structure of the buildings and the actual heats the fires would have attained. He also analyzed the FEMA and NIST reports which are the only official reports regarding the actual collapses of the buildings.

5:12 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

First of all lets discuss buildings falling down. Construction began on the WTC1 in 1966 and was completed in 1972. This means designs were completed even before 1966, at least 12 years before the Boeing 767-200 which ultimitely led to its sad demise was designed. Yes, its true that the buildings were designed to withstand an airplane crashing into them... just a much smaller one. The fact that they stayed standing long enough for people to get away is a testiment to just how well they were designed. However, no matter how strong they built in 1970 they could not have planned for or forseen the 767. So the two tallest buildings in NYC fall down and hit a nearby building... lets face it, that building is sure to collapse. It was on fire for 7 hours! Fireproof to steel all you want amigos, it won't stand up to 7 hours of intense heat. So WTC7 came down. Of course they knew, they are firefighters. I truly hope you guys have digested this little tidbit... because while ignorance is bliss, it's also unhealthy.

Moving on, I want to point out that I agree that there is some sort of conspiracy. Just like at Pearl Harbor 60 years ago, we knew. But calling it an Israeli/Zionist plot is just insane. Bin Laden has been threatening the US for years and years. He's tried taking out the WTC before. And trust me, the only country Osama hates (hated?) more than the US is Israel.

Lets look at what Israel has to gain from these wars... luckily, we have a past example... the Persian Gulf War, better known as Operation Desert Storm. What happened then? Israel got bombed. Over and over and over.

Know what? forget this... I'm disgusted by all of you. And while I would like to show you the truth, you are too blinded by irrational hate, fear, and lazyness to actually understand that truth is what you are seeing.

12:33 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I do think there's plenty we don't know about 9/11, and that the US federal government was complicit. But I don't think that any one person knowing the towers would fall is evidence of conspiracy. At work, we were all watching the news coverage on a TV in the cafeteria. Most of those assembled were engineers, and we were all yelling at each other, "Why are they set up at the base of the towers? Why do they keep sending people in? The towers are going to collapse!" All of us felt sick when we saw it, but none of us were surprised. I'm more surprised that the response teams didn't realize the towers would fall.

3:51 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

To find human bone fragments displaced hundreds of yards horizontally
from the footprint of the wtc
collapsed buildings..on neighboring
tops of buildings suggest an explosion occured not vertically
displacement..falling..collapse.

2:30 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

C'mon, wake up people--9/11 stinks to high heaven. It was designed to justify a U.S. invasion of the Middle East (Iraq, Iran, Syria), while squelching domestic dissent at home (Patriot Act, bush's executive orders, etc.).

Anyone who still believes this official 9/11 garbage has their head planted deep in the sand. "Why would we attack OURSELF?" some morons like to ask. As if the elite rulers of this country (and planet) care about the peons & serfs they trample on daily. You think Bush cares about the troops he "surges" into Baghdad? They are pawns to these neo-cons.

The world is run by a group of elites sitting on top of a vast power-pyramid. They give us the illusion of democracy so we'll shut up, but they consider democracy to be 'mob rule.' Bankers and corporatists don't give a damn about our lives, and you're a complete fool if you think that the elite wouldn't pull a stunt like 9/11. Go watch Alex Jones's _Terrorstorm_ & _Martial Law_, also check out Aaron Russo's _America: Freedom to Fascism_. The American income tax has been illegal from the get-go, but they farm the American people like worms.

2:56 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Nice article .. it's been picked up by http://www.spiderednews.com/911.htm

3:50 PM  
Blogger William R. Schultz / The Majority Voice said...

Are the people finally waking up to the obvious fact that the MSM had scripted advanced knowledge of the 9/11 attacks and have been the main accomplices in the cover-up of the crimes?

I have been a lone voice in the wilderness on this fact for years.

http://www.asylumgoons.blogspot.com

2:51 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You guys are morons. How on earth can u believe this crap?! How about you tell the families of the people who died in 9/11 that there death was orchestrated by the government. Seriously, use your obviously tiny brains properly.

12:02 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

GOOD GOLLY MISS MOLLY!

I've seen da light! praise da lord.....

...I guess tomorrow when y'all get some "evidence" re slavery, taxes, the genocide of the aboriginals, the creation of legal definitions of "race" to up the ante in the class war and the fallacy called the civil war thingses will get a little betteror....[not]

I mean, like, um, how much evidence do y'all need?

freedom....um, wait: FREEDOM is NOT optional....


I guess when you awaken to find a d*ck shoved roughly [and deeply...so very deeply] into your @zz, y'all will finally have "enough" "evidence" to, um, do what?....but then again....

I ditto anon:

"watching detective stories are a part of the American peoples problem, besides when the evidence is standing there before you in the form of what had, did, and followed that day one would have to have some severe mental defeciancies to have not figured it out by the time the second plane hit. No detective work needed here, those events do not happen in reality, they are impossible and absurd to the point of being unworthy of a B hollywood movie.
The biggest challenge is to get the masses of the pathetic broken American people to find courage and morality to face , not the powers that be, oh no, they need to look themselves in the mirror and face the reality of who they are, what they've become, and where they would like to go from here"



...indeed...or as it is heard in "da hood": word up!
....c'est la vie

1:35 PM  
Blogger Bryce Digdug said...

According to http://usinfo.state.gov/xarchives/display.html?p=pubs-english&y=2006&m=August&x=20060828133846esnamfuaK0.2676355 it was Ben Laden who knew in advance "“We calculated in advance the number of casualties … who would be killed …. I was the most optimistic of them all. … Due to my experience in this field, I was thinking that the fire from the gas in the plane would melt the iron structure of the building and collapse the area where the plane hit and all the floors above it only.”
Ain't that the most ridiculous planted quote of all time? Since no steel building had ever collapsed before from fire? Talk about a witness for the prosecution! Of course "ben Laden" always speaks at the most convenient times for the Bush administration.

10:14 PM  
Blogger Bryce Digdug said...

Search for "The Top September 11 Conspiracy Theories" and you will see a list from the State Department USINFO. This is where a "ben Laden" claims to know in advance about the towers collapsing even though no steel towers had ever collapse. It puts the words about the collapse in "ben Laden"'s mouth. In a very clumsy and obvious way this is just U.S. propaganda. The State Department makes fools of themselves and puts the U.S. government under suspicion of conspiracy.

10:22 PM  
Blogger Human said...

I linked to this on a new post about Suskinds 911 revelations he wrote about in his newly released book.
Peace.

7:53 AM  
Blogger Morbilim said...

I am a soldier, I did three tours in Iraq because of the enormous hate, rage, and fear generated by the EVENT of 9 1 1 I was angry too but I never learned at whom I was angry. I didn't know what or who to believe. That was 11 years ago and I am still deeply wounded by that day and do not believe-somehow that we got the right people,

6:55 PM  

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